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Engerek01: 3. Sniper is a killer and we already know that the sniper killed 2 people. If Joe was the sniper, ZFR would know that.
No. I can only find out third party killers. SK or Lyncher. Not Mafia.

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dedoporno: You got healed and was allowed to investigate in the same night?
Yes. I asked Lift and his answer amounted to maybe yes maybe no maybe go play with yourself. Turns out yes.

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ZFR: Counterpoint: He did it to "prove" he's Hider.
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dedoporno: Are you referring to Coward? What's Hider?
Potayto Potahto.

(actually isn't the "Coward" role called Hider elswhere on Mafia wiki?)
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ZFR: Yes. I asked Lift and his answer amounted to maybe yes maybe no maybe go play with yourself. Turns out yes.
Oh boy!

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ZFR: (actually isn't the "Coward" role called Hider elswhere on Mafia wiki?)
No idea, I never heard of either till this game, that's why I asked.
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ZFR: (actually isn't the "Coward" role called Hider elswhere on Mafia wiki?)
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dedoporno: No idea, I never heard of either till this game, that's why I asked.
Turns out not exactly. Hider is different
https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Hider
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JoeSapphire: couldn't have done it without you

can I have my boobs back now?
I have to admit it was great teamwork: A great assist followed by an excellent slam dunk

And No-way. The effect suggested that you turned into a handsome man. I don't want to ruin that :)

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ZFR: No. I can only find out third party killers. SK or Lyncher. Not Mafia.
Can someone please elaborate that or lead me to a source where I can understand it better.
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ZFR: No. I can only find out third party killers. SK or Lyncher. Not Mafia.
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Engerek01: Can someone please elaborate that or lead me to a source where I can understand it better.
Third party roles don't belong to either faction (nor Town nor Mafia). They have their own win conditions. e.g. Survivor's condition is to be alive at the end, regardless who wins.

Some third party roles can kill

Serial Killer:
https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Serial_Killer

Lyncher doesn't kill per se, but wins when his target (Lynchee) dies. It's specifically mentioned to give a positive result to my FBI profiler
https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Condemner

(NOTE: the role has been recently renamed to Condenmer in line with mafiascum's policy of avoiding the dreadful L-word).
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Engerek01: Can someone please elaborate that or lead me to a source where I can understand it better.
There is supposedly a 3rd party in the game or ZFR's claimed role is a red herring. Or he is lying about it.
new page bump
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ZFR: new page bump
Quick reply working again, too.
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ZFR: Catte, what did you do N1? What was that about me and Joe?
I watched trent on N1. At that point I still thought there was a reasonable chance he was

town and would self confirm the next day so I thought I might catch someone coming to kill

him. Instead the only person I saw visit him was GH, which is something we found out the

next day anyway.

Last night I used coward-finder on bucktoothgamer, which would have given me a positive or

negative result and verified his claim. The fact it failed obviously has no bearing on

btg's alignment, but I'm beginning to think my instincts were right.

Is that second question aimed at me? You'll need to be more specific because it's not

ringing any bells.

Why didn't you investigate flub again on N2 since you didn't get a chance to on N1? You said you suspected him of being a lyncher, what changed?

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ZFR: (Incidentally, I don't think Lift should have informed the targeted player

that they were infected. Just have them fail results.
It seems Lift is unnecessarily doing it to many roles in his games, like bucktooth/catte

today. Unless they're Loud, targets shouldn't know they've been targeted).
Well my role is explicitly LOUD in the event of a failure, I have conditional loud

modifier. As for being infected, it sounds like you lost your night action on the night you

were infected and gained it on the night you were healed. Given the way it seems to work,

you might be able to infer that you were infected anyway, although I guess you're thinking

it should be indistinguishable from being roleblocked or jailed?

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bucktoothgamer: 3. If my PR role was nerfed after I claimed, why do they keep giving me opportunity to

use it? The reason I claimed after n1 in the first place was that I figured letting the

group know that we had 2 potential targets of a scum attack may have given us more insight

on who to lynch.
Because your power is harmless to them as long as they don't aim at you. Knowledge is

enough to protect them from you, they don't need to kill you when they could be killing

someone else.

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JoeSapphire: PERHAPS something like a power-embargo should be considered? Just to give the

mafia a bit of a sporting chance towards the end of the game?
Lolno.

Spoken like a true yogsloth in the first Harry Potter game.

(For those of you who weren't there, I mean a mafioso complaining the game is unfair.)

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ZFR: Take me for example, I know I was infected and I announced it. With trent's flip we have a

confirmed Infector.

This helps confirm me as Town (or rather non-Mafia). Since no one else claimed to be

Infected, my claim must be true. The only way I'm not non-Mafia is if trent purposely

withheld using his power in order to "clear" me. This would require superWIFOM from Mafia's

side: they're essentially giving up one of their strongest weapons - permablock.
It had crossed my mind that the note to Trent and the infection thing could be an elaborate

ruse. You are both experienced players after all. You'd only need to withhold it for one

night for the plan to work (it wasn't a sure thing that you'd lose Trent on D2 after all).

I'm not sure how I feel about you having brought it up, that in itself is WIFOMy. On the

one hand why would scum!ZFR draw attention to what actually happened? On the other hand,

perhaps that's the point.

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JoeSapphire: if he's willing to bus trent on day one for no reason, why doesn't he bus trent day two

when he's actually going down?

looks to me like he believed trent's claim, and thought blotunga was mafia
Well being second on trent's wagon on D1, it's possible he didn't think trent was a likely

lynch and it was a distancing vote. Once the wagon got going he couldn't really jump off

without a good reason. On D2 when the wagon was for realz from the start, he couldn't bring

himself to bus his buddy. I dunno, it's not completely damning but it's far from making him

look particularly townie.

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GymHenson: I don't either....likely will cast my vote for them in a bit.
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JoeSapphire: what about him being second on trentonlf's wagon day one?
and nothing on his wagon day two?

that's a townie look from where I'm sitting
Ok, that's the second time you've posted exactly this. You're awfully eager to dissuade

people from voting for him.
If scum, second vote on D1 is hardly bussing and more likely distancing.
Reluctance to join that wagon on D2 looks more like reluctance to bus. It's not strong either way, it neither condemns nor aquits him.

It's kind of weird that you're putting this much effort into defending him. Is btg your buddy and are you freaking out about possibly losing him so soon after bussing trent?

I see there's still another page to come so I'll post this and carry on.
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my name is vaughlte catte: I see there's still another page to come so I'll post this and carry on.
hope there's no shocking revelations on the next page that make all the stuff you just said irrelevant!
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ZFR: Third party roles don't belong to either faction (nor Town nor Mafia). They have their own win conditions. e.g. Survivor's condition is to be alive at the end, regardless who wins.

.....
Thank you very much for this.

Oh God, now I have to think about 3rd parties... My brain hurts... so many possibilities :))
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dedoporno: I wouldn't approve of it as everyone is playing in the same game and could have rolled into any other slot.
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JoeSapphire: okay cool.

Another question: IF you were scum and were out last night, let's say for the sake of argument that you were shooting blotunga in the head, or - well the point stands with anything but anyway - and someone caught you in the act, let's imagine HYPOTHETICALLY that it was me for example, would you prefer for me - or whoever it was - to come out with that information, or would you prefer they pretend to not know about it for old time's sake?
Well this is heading in an interesting direction.

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JoeSapphire: okay neat cheers hun xxx

I am Clover, Town Watch'er/Track'er

Night One I went for ZFR - ZFR's a lady so I saw Gym and Trent visiting him. (I'm sorry, I know I made it look like I was just a brilliant master of seeing through lies but I was cheating I already knew trent was scum)

I felt kinda bad that I didn't watch vitek but I thought ah whatever I'll just find the sniper the second night.

Night Two I watched blotunga and saw dedo and bucktooth visit him.

Yes, yes, I'm amazing. Thank you, thank you.
Oho! AH!

Hmm, this is interesting. You have no way of knowing which killed blotunga so it's kind of weird that you're exonerating btg with no particular reasoning, but it's good that we can narrow it down.

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JoeSapphire: and saw dedo [...] visit him.
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dedoporno: That's true. You caught me.
Oh, well that was easy?

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Engerek01: 3. Sniper is a killer and we already know that the sniper killed 2 people. If Joe was the sniper, ZFR would know that. He "could" still be scum but not the killer.
ZFR finds neutral killing roles. As he said in his claim, all he knows is that Joe is town or mafia and not neutral. Still, I'm not suggesting Joe is scum, just that ZFR hasn't proven him not to be.

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my name is vaughlte catte: I see there's still another page to come so I'll post this and carry on.
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JoeSapphire: hope there's no shocking revelations on the next page that make all the stuff you just said irrelevant!
Curse you! Also well done.

I have to say I'm a little confused as to why dedo gave up so easily. All he had to do was falseclaim and point the finger at btg.
does scum hunter send a message to his scumbuddy through the courrier?

does scum engerek start shooting off in all directions, or do they just quietly make their team untrackable?

does scum catte try and do something to bucktooth? what could that be?
Lolle, forgot to

vote dedo
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my name is vaughlte catte: ...
Sheer poetry.

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my name is vaughlte catte: Why didn't you investigate flub again on N2 since you didn't get a chance to on N1? You said you suspected him of being a lyncher, what changed?
Guys, I caught the third scum!