Not in English. It was about how the unstudded winter tires are rated in the whole EU zone, and those ratings are unsuitable to e.g. Finnish winters, as the ratings are designed solely for wet conditions.

http://www.taloussanomat.fi/autot/2012/05/29/nokian-renkaat-uusi-eu-merkinta-ei-kerro-kitkarenkaiden-jaapidosta/201230343/304

Yet, we have to use the same ratings here too. Choosing your winter tires according to those ratings may lead people to choose tires completely unsuitable (even hazardous) for Finnish winters.

Why? You are from Australia, aren't you?

I've never understood why non-EU people are so much for e.g. Turkey being part of EU. I personally don't feel that strongly about e.g. whether Quebec should be part of Canada, or not. Not my business and it doesn't affect me one way or the other, like Turkey becoming part of EU might.

Posting in a troll thread

I also see a problem with immigration. It would make it much easier for them to immigrate if they can travel free in European countries. I don't have anything against immigrants. A lot of turkish people are good educated and live like people in other european countrys. But in fact usually not the good educated and sophisticated people immigrate to Germany which would bring a use to the country. I must admit that Germany hasn't the best politics to appeal to high educated people from foreign countries. Most of the immigrants are poor and high religios people, often Kurds which aren't even accepted in Turkey. We don't need more such people here who only profit out of our social system. Türkisch people are the far most immigrants here in germany with about 2.527.000 people. The next highest number of immigrants are italians with only about 761.000 people. The problem is you can't say to one part of the turkish population that they are free to immigrate but deny it to the other part if they are in the EU.

The topic as a whole is mute from several points. First of all let me say I am a Turkish citizen and I would ideally say Turkey belongs in EU.

The discussion is mute because there are simply too many paradoxes involved.

The idea or the ideal of EU is the creation of a single state that can be called a global power and can hold its against united states, russia or/and china. This is not just a political ideal. In order to achive this EU needs to be a whole and strong in areas like; economic, military, legal, science and population.

There are two key parts of that ideal, one is being whole. What makes a country whole? Language, religion, customs, money, economics... and several other things as well. From this point Turkey is a huge problem. We simply are different. Completely different language and history, different customs, different religion...

The other part of the ideal is becoming a global power. Well on that regard, Turkey is a huge asset. With a large and young population, both educated and uneducated (lets say blue and white collar) work force, strong economy and military....

Can you see the paradox?

Anyhow that ideal with or without Turkey is a long way ahead and may never be achieved. Lets talk todays world.

EU is currently a free trade union, that has space for improvement. The largest countries (and the most economically strong) are Germany and France, and they hold much of the political power. Britain looks at the E.U. from a distance, however never stays far from it so lets put them away for a minute. Germany has a population of 80m and France is around 65m. The other countries are much smaller from a population point of view. Turkey has a population of 75m. Although Turkey is becoming stronger economically it is nowhere near Germany or France.

Why am I talking about these numbers? Well... E.U. is a democracy, elections are based on population... I guess everyone can see the trouble here :)

On the other hand. Both Germany and France rely on immigrants for a significant part of their workforce. And all around Europe a good part of that workforce is Turkish... Also Turkey itself is a huge market for a lot of industries...

I can write more on the subject... There are legal, cultural, democratical, political, educational regional aspects of this discussion. Overall it boils down to this. Turkey is unsuitable for the E.U. and E.U. can not afford not to let Turkey in.

Why do you think for over 50 years Turkey has not been allowed to join?

Maybe the whole population thing is much accurately shown in this. Check it out;

[url=http://www.google.com.tr/publicdata/explore?ds=d5bncppjof8f9_&ctype=l&strail=false&bcs=d&nselm=h&met_y=sp_pop_totl&scale_y=lin&ind_y=false&rdim=region&idim=country:TUR:DEU:FRA:GBR:ESP:NLD:ITA:GRC:FIN&ifdim=region&hl=en&dl=en&ind=false]http://www.google.com.tr/publicdata/explore?ds=d5bncppjof8f9_&ctype=l&strail=false&bcs=d&nselm=h&met_y=sp_pop_totl&scale_y=lin&ind_y=false&rdim=region&idim=country:TUR:DEU:FRA:GBR:ESP:NLD:ITA:GRC:FIN&ifdim=region&hl=en&dl=en&ind=false[/url]

United foreign policy might mean "whatever Germany/France decides", which is what smaller countries don't want either. For instance, the ramifications of e.g. EU sanctions to Russia may mean completely different things to e.g. Finland and France.

For united defense system, I think NATO is the one for Europe at the moment.

Many sceptics also feel free travel has also meant free travel for criminals, hence many countries have started putting up more rigid check-ups on their borders again. The movement of labor also means national social security may need to be changed, e.g. if someone from Estonia comes to work for awhile to Finland (while still actually living in Estonia) and pays taxes here, his/her family back in Estonia suddenly becomes eligible for extended Finnish child support etc., even though they don't even live in Finland. Then again, if they were not eligible to all the same benefits as Finnish people, should they pay any income tax to Finland either? A tricky question.

For common currency to work, EU would have to be much more tightly together what it is today. Even Germany doesn't apparently want German banks to be regulated and dictated by other countries. Common currency would work better if the EU countries and their economies weren't so wildly different. Like, whether Euro can be considered "too strong" or "too weak" depends on the EU country, so by whose wishes will the European Central Bank make the economic decisions?

I don't see from a geographical point why Turkey or Russia should be in the EU. They belong mostly to Asia, not to Europe.

Politically, however, I can see it, Byzanz is an important city still today, and Russia controls the EU gas market.

It is as absurd as listing Israel for Europe in sports (which indeed happened).

Even were Turkey to get to final round negotiations on EU membership, to get in, they would need Greece to not veto their accession. This seems somewhat unlikely.

Turkey is just paving the way into European Union for Duck and Chicken.

It probably would depend on how tight the political integration would be. Maybe one could be an associated member until a time when the cultural differences get smaller. Even now there is a lot of trade going on and nothing of this is hindered much by Turkey not being a member of the EU. Everyone is different from others. As long as everyone agrees on democracy and freedom and respect and as long as there is enough regional autonomy.. it might even work to have different countries working closely together.

Language is probably the least problem. Already now Europe is like Babel compared to other regions of the world (for example both Americas). Everyone just learns English as second language and everything is fine. The GOG community works this way.

We could make travel much easier. Turkish citizen travelling the EU need to jump over quite some hurdles.

My impression was that the demonstrators from last year in Turkey showed a very mature and progressive Turkey. Unfortunately the whole Turkey is probably different.

lol nope, they don't let us vote on issues, just persons, Switzerland where they do that isn't part of the EU.

I wouldn't have any problem with European Union being renamed to Eurasian Union.

maybe check the country of origin better below his avatar it says austria not australia

no. i just live here

seeing how much trouble greece is causing rest of the europe if the veto Turkey then they should be kicked out.

Yeah. NO! About that...
It has NEVER been a "free" trade union. Ever. That's what was sold to millions of people, especially here in the UK as enticement to join. It is NOT the reality though.
It IS a Customs Union. That means it is a protectorate of select (read : Germany's, possibly France's) economies.
TPIP will distort that even further, with enforcing laws and tax deals to support American economic interests, even should they be at odds with worker's rights, human rights, and civil rights. [Although, I think I remember that one being nixed because TPP, which is similar in scope and interests, got outed].

In theory, it's something akin to a democracy. As much as any system with more than 2 voices is a democracy, and not in reality "mob rule".
In reality, the only people-elected body, EuroParl, exists solely to be a YESMAN to the totally unelected Kommission.
There's talk to "reform" that situation, but I ain't a holdin' ma breath, darlin'.

What seems to be the overall feeling in Constantinople?