toxicTom: No? Steam can effectively lock you out. Games gone. GOG can't. Everything that you have is yours to keep, even if you lose your account. Of course it's your responsibility to make sure of backups and stuff - just like with physical media. CDs/DVDs don't have unlimited lifespans either.

Ganni1987: Everytime I need to play a game on Steam I need to log on the client, have the client open and be on internet (excluding the "offline mode"). I don't want to ask permission from mommy valve or have her sit next to me while I play.

With GOG, I can simply shake hands > thanks for the transaction and once I download the game I can forget about the store entirely. My game will work as long as I have a backup.

You're slightly wrong on that "exactly the same on both services" line, on an EULA level it might be the same, But If it was really the same there wouldn't be a copy protection on the Steam version.

Take a look at this news. Did the "owners" actually own the game? It isn't a matter what kind of game was online/offline, the point is that they didn't have any control over it. If this was on GOG and the game's servers would shut down, you still have what you paid for, regardless if the game works or not.

This is my definition of renting.

amok: So are you saying that when you buy a CD you are renting a game? If gOg folds and my house burn down with my games, where I only renting the games? This are issues of access, not ownership.

amok: No, the ownership is exactly the same. The difference is that gOg entrust its users to uphold the license agreement, while on Steam it can be enforces. However, this do not change the actual ownership.

BeckHansen: I know that everyone has a different view on any given subject, but i could never understand why people are so afraid of playing while valve (seemingly) watches.

So what if they see i just played a match of CSGO? Will they suggest me a cod game next time i logon ? Maybe, but that's just a tiny portion of the store, i get suggested items everywhere i shop, on the net, i m still living and picking my purchases.

About that game that got erased, ok, that was bad and a first. You have to acknowledge what the game actually was though.
The game was a multiplayer focused game, that albeit having some single player options, was probably hard coded to be online only.
The company was no longer willing to provide a service, and valve couldn't do anything about it.

HereForTheBeer: No, it isn't.

There is no mandatory gOg client that can shut down access to your games. Unless gOg is going to send Duke Nukem over here to forcibly uninstall the titles I bought and also delete the installers, then there is no practical limitation placed on me after the title is downloaded. Steam can simply cut off access to your account and that's that - kiss your library of DRM-encumbered titles goodbye.

If that isn't a difference then I don't know what is.

amok: So are you saying that when you buy a CD you are renting a game? If gOg folds and my house burn down with my games, where I only renting the games? This are issues of access, not ownership.

darthspudius: What is the risk exactly? It's exactly the same as buying from GOG, Humble bundle or other online companies.

amok: gOg can also cut me out of my library (it is in the ToS), or fold, and if that happens and if my house burn down - I can kiss my DRM free library goodbye also.

BeckHansen: I know that everyone has a different view on any given subject, but i could never understand why people are so afraid of playing while valve (seemingly) watches.

So what if they see i just played a match of CSGO? Will they suggest me a cod game next time i logon ? Maybe, but that's just a tiny portion of the store, i get suggested items everywhere i shop, on the net, i m still living and picking my purchases.

About that game that got erased, ok, that was bad and a first. You have to acknowledge what the game actually was though.
The game was a multiplayer focused game, that albeit having some single player options, was probably hard coded to be online only.
The company was no longer willing to provide a service, and valve couldn't do anything about it.

toxicTom: No? Are you trying to misunderstand me? When you buy a game on Steam you are effectively renting it. It's not yours. They can take it away anytime for any reason (like using a proxy server to get a legitmately bought Manhunt 2 activated).

If I have the game on CD nobody can take it away. If I bought a game on GOG nobody can take it away (as long as I've downloaded it).

In this regard GOG is even better than the CD in many cases. CDs age and break and need backups too. But a lot of games on CD have copy protection - to have a working backup you need a crack from shady sources.

I'm positive that my GOG games will be playable by my grandchildren - emulation ftw. - see Wine, DOSBox, GLide wrappers...

toxicTom: No? Are you trying to misunderstand me? When you buy a game on Steam you are effectively renting it. It's not yours. They can take it away anytime for any reason (like using a proxy server to get a legitmately bought Manhunt 2 activated).

toxicTom: If I have the game on CD nobody can take it away.

toxicTom: If I bought a game on GOG nobody can take it away (as long as I've downloaded it).

toxicTom: In this regard GOG is even better than the CD in many cases. CDs age and break and need backups too. But a lot of games on CD have copy protection - to have a working backup you need a crack from shady sources.

toxicTom: I'm positive that my GOG games will be playable by my grandchildren - emulation ftw. - see Wine, DOSBox, GLide wrappers...

toxicTom: They can revoke your account, yes. As for the house burning down... Nobody prevents you from storing your GOG library elsewhere. Googledrive is currently 1TB/$9.99 per month...

ET3D: Yea, but we're talking (at least originally) about Skyrim, a game that's widely known and costs $5 on sales. We're talking about someone who wants to play the game. Sure, he could play another game, but I feel that spending $5 on this game on Steam is acceptable risk, and certainly worth it if he enjoys the game. Sure, if ideology is involved then that trumps practical considerations, but if he doesn't care about that, there's nothing particularly limiting about Steam that would make buying that game not worth it. Even if he ends up not liking Steam that much, he would still have enjoyed the game.

ET3D: Read the rest of the thread. Buying a DRM'ed game on Steam does come with limitations (exaggerated by some here), which some people care about. My feeling is that even if you care about that, spending $5 on Steam for a game you want and intend to play (and isn't available DRM-free) is the way to go (unless you're ideologically strongly opposed to it).

toxicTom: ...

amok: ...

rtcvb32: Can we all just agree that having games and programs that don't contain malicious code that has the chance to bite you in the ass, is better than having it?

Ganni1987: It doesn't matter if it was hard coded or not, those people bought the game, if the servers were shut down ok fine I get it, but leave my darn dead game in my library, that's how I go about it.

For me it's not "being afraid", it's about something I am in control of, something I own. If I buy a game, I don't want to knock on nobody's server to play a single player game I paid for, just as I don't go knocking on no developer's door telling them how they should spend my money.