It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
Lots of responses :)

avatar
cal74: 9) Did that too. Kids are spoiled these days ;)
Yes they are. Sad since piping commands is more effective than a gui (and more flexible/portable).

Too bad MS-DOS piping was broken. (an EOF or null would break the data, making it overall text-only, at least from my memory of using v6)

avatar
Themken: A pity rtcvb32's questionnaire is only aimed at young people.

Of course it is yes to most of those questions.
Nothing's stopping you from taking it. GameRager commented about the ages, and i came up with some questions that seemed relevant to that time. Being older you might have had to deal with worse. Say a computer using punch cards...

Early 8bit computers had something like 4k-8k of ram, and a 8k ROM slot. (Not a lot of space) but before that, you had a lot less! A surprise anything got done at all!
avatar
rtcvb32: Well free software (typically GNU or GPL'd) you just download the sources and compile, or download the pre-built binaries and use.

Though the business model could include paying for it, As Stallman says 'free as in free speech not free beer'. One early example of success was RedHat which you could download it for free, however if you paid for it you were paying for customer service and tech support and not for the price of the software (considering 90% of it was already made software by other sources, a distro you just compile the packages you want and master an iso to burn usually).

The only big reason i can think to 'pirate' free software, would be if you wanted to hijack and add unwanted code, though most downloads includes MD5 and other checks to ensure the data was untampered with.
I was more talking about would it be possible to "pirate" free software by downloading/using a version not meant for you/your "class"(i.e. business or personal).....as in would that be considered pirating? :|
==============================

avatar
GameRager: I noticed quite a few I reply to were born in that year or around it.....I wonder if Gog attracts a ton of 30 somethings due to the classic gaming angle.
avatar
rtcvb32: Wouldn't be surprised. We all would have had experience with the first generation of 8bit computers and had it in schools. Then there's the NES and other early handhelds, when we had perhaps the worst of what was to offer before hardware picked up and gave you something better.

Plus a number of games GoG originally sold was heavily 80's and 90's games, or more or less what other companies considered junk and they didn't think they'd make any money on. Games the only way to get ahold of them WAS to pirate it because they weren't otherwise preserved.
True enough
===============================

avatar
rtcvb32: Perhaps we should have a survey. Anyone 30-40 years old, did you:
1) Use/own a 8bit computer? (Atari, Apple2, Commodore 64, Sinclair, etc)
2) Do any BASIC programming (in school probably, not the same as #5)
3) Run/load software using a tape player
4) Use a 1 button joystick
5) Enter a game/program from a magazine (Could have borrowed a book from the library too with BASIC games, usually text only and not system specific)
6) Play/own an NES and games? (or at least rent them when video stores still existed)
7) configure your autoexec.bat or config.sys files to get games to run in MS-DOS?
8) Find shareware games were your best friend? (MS-DOS)
9) Have to use pkzip to extract files.
10) Used Windows 3.11 to any degree
1. I did use Apple 2e/etc to play some games like Wheel of Fortune/Jeopardy/Oregon Trail/etc, and newer PCs to run some games a teacher let us play in PC lab like 7th Guest/Dark Seed/etc.
-------------
2. No, but I DID make my own game(In AGS, with the Reality-On-The-Norm series/verse) plus a small prequel to it. I also wanted to learn to make games in college but dropped out due to them wanting us to learn coding(not my forte/passion) as well in their offered courses.
-------------
3. Nope.....that was way before my time. I DO have some old 8 tracks, though, from my parents old collection.
-------------
4. I don't think I did beyond arcade gaming.
-------------
5. Nope....didn;t even know those existed, tbh.
------------
6. I DID own an SNES my sibling bought me YEARS and years ago, and love Mortal Kombat/it's music. I also played/rented some games from stores when I had spending money.
-------------
7. This a thousand times(hyperbole).....I had to do such for System Shock 1/Dark Seed/other games. I also trimmed unneeded stuff from my older windows installs(OEM stuff and extra windows stuff).
-----------
8. This as well.....they were welcome when I was low on money and didn't have much to play.
------------
9. I think so, many years ago....along with stuff like 7Zip, WinRar, etc.
------------
10. Again, that was before my time, so I never used it. I do emulate it sometimes for older games(iirc), though.
avatar
Timboli: Has the OP provided what game and what Dev yet? Probably not and I suspect this is just a topic to stir up some controversy.


Basically, if it is a choice between a cracked version or an original clean DRM-Free version, I would imagine the latter is the preferred option. It is a matter of conscience though, and whether one is willing to bite the hand that feeds, and the threat against GOG's continued existence.
1st bit: I don't think the OP is one to stir the pot for a laugh/etc...just my two cents.

2nd bit: Eh, I would suspect the ones who balk at sales "not being good enough" even when the prices are more than 60% off or find any excuse to not buy games they have wishlisted as more of a threat to gog's existence then a few pirates who wouldn't have paid for the games anyways.

Of course, saying that I think many many more should buy games on Gog to help it grow.

==============
avatar
KiNgBrAdLeY7: GOG is a cause for DROPPING PIRACY! It eliminates ANY reason to pirate a game... You need no crack, you can manually burn it, you can keep it, admire it...
Not any/all reasons....some games will likely never see a legal release for the foreseeable future that contains our lifetimes.
Post edited October 11, 2019 by GameRager
avatar
GameRager: 2nd bit: Eh, I would suspect the ones who balk at sales "not being good enough" even when the prices are more than 60% off or find any excuse to not buy games they have wishlisted as more of a threat to gog's existence then a few pirates who wouldn't have paid for the games anyways.
Why are they a threat any more than the rest of the 7.5 billion people on planet earth who don't buy games from GOG?
avatar
clarry: Why are they a threat any more than the rest of the 7.5 billion people on planet earth who don't buy games from GOG?
Not a threat perse(and not even that bad compared to steam being a thing, which threatens Gog more imo), but more like not helping either(at least financially).

In order for Gog to do well/grow, people need to buy games, and those not buying/not buying much(for some reason or other) aren't helping gog's bottom line much.

That said I am not trying to take a major dig at such people....just trying to subtlely prod some into helping gog a bit more from time to time. ;)
avatar
Zrevnur: For some developers its simply an "ego" thing. They somehow believe they have the right to dictate the whole of society whatever they want with DRM. (IMO this is "selective justice" which is no justice at all.) For other developers its just a money thing
avatar
clarry: For some I think it's just irrational knee-jerk like reaction to the idea of someone doing something with something they own.

I mean if you've ever watched a five-year-old kid throw a tantrum whenever a sibling or visiting kid approaches and tries to touch any of their toys, you know what I mean. The toy's owner kid rushes to grab their toy away from the offender, screams "don't take it it's mine!" Thankfully not all kids are like that but from what I've seen, it's surprisingly common.
Thats part of what I meant with '"ego" thing'.

avatar
clarry: Another manifestation of this is on the internet on forms where people (kids..) learn to code or do arts or stuff. Like for example, on game development forums, you always find cringeworthy 13-year-olds announcing their new super cool game project. Of course, they have nothing to show except something like a main menu drawn in paint, where the most outstanding element is a copyright sign followed by their nickname and big bold letters "COPYING IS FORBIDDEN" or something equally silly. I wish I were joking...

I don't think there's much rational thought behind any of that, it's just something they do because 1) they can, 2) they're used to it and are just (perhaps subconsciously?) mimicking the stuff that big corporations put in every splash screen, intro page, back cover, etc., 3) they never questioned it.
Maybe they see the cool game and want to copy it in its full glorious coolness but thats too hard so they just copy(*) the "COPYING IS FORBIDDEN" part and it makes them feel all cool and fuzzy at the same time or sth.

(*) pun intended
1) Use/own a 8bit computer? (Atari, Apple2, Commodore 64, Sinclair, etc)Yes. I had a Tandy 1000 HX, 1st pc. I remember using a C64 for games if we did good in elementary class.
2) Do any BASIC programming (in school probably, not the same as #5) Yes, in high school.
3) Run/load software using a tape player. Not sure. Do Texas Instruments TI-99/4A cartridges count?
4) Use a 1 button joystick. Yes, Tandy "Deluxe" Joystick
5) Enter a game/program from a magazine (Could have borrowed a book from the library too with BASIC games, usually text only and not system specific). Do shareware CDs count?
6) Play/own an NES and games? (or at least rent them when video stores still existed) Yes.
7) configure your autoexec.bat or config.sys files to get games to run in MS-DOS? I had to. Some games are very picky. I used a boot disk.
8) Find shareware games were your best friend? (MS-DOS) Yes, Doom, Heretic, Duke Nukem, DN3D
9) Have to use pkzip to extract files. Yes
10) Used Windows 3.11 to any degree Yes, I loathe bluescreens.
I see the discussion through this prism...

Did Game of Thrones piracy (the most-pirated tv show in history) hurt HBO subscriptions or the sales of GoT merchandise (including book)?
avatar
GameRager: I was more talking about would it be possible to "pirate" free software by downloading/using a version not meant for you/your "class"(i.e. business or personal).....as in would that be considered pirating? :|
I can't think of where this 'class' would come into being.

I know Microsoft has put differences between 'business' and 'personal' by implementing limits. (Example, Windows XP could only accept 64 simultaneous connections max unless it was a 'server' edition. It was found to be binarily identical to the personal Windows XP, but with a few registry tweaks which Microsoft would sell you $800 more).

With free software, you specify the limits (in the configuration), and there isn't really a difference from the software perspective.. (Also any limitations you put in as a 'personal' version could be stripped and recompiled to remove it, making it pointless).

Is there a 'business' version of AWK vs a 'personal' version of AWK? I don't see why there would be. Or GIT, or XWindows?
avatar
DavidOrion93: 3) Run/load software using a tape player. Not sure. Do Texas Instruments TI-99/4A cartridges count?
Not sure. Typically i think of this when i think of a tape player for it. though some 8bit computers had it built into the computer too, i think the Sinclair was one.

Also you had to put "CLOAD" command in, then hit play. The details of the data and how it is stored on cassette is is quite interesting. It starts with an 0xAA code (10101010) byte to identify speed in case it's slow for timing, then a byte which is how many bytes in the next sector/block, and then the block is up to 128 bytes long.

Getting into the Tokens of MS-BASIC (how it's stored when saved) is also quite interesting...
Post edited October 12, 2019 by rtcvb32
if anything is causing piracy its not gog its places like steam with there DRM, id rather pirate a game than be forced to install shitty steam and rent my games for £30+, and the your not supporting the developers is so 90's cos in the 90's devs cared about making good games, now all they care about is rushing out games and getting as much cash as possible they dnt care about the games or the users that play them, the only devs that probably do care are indie devs.

said this in another thread but its true fuck these games devs normally id say triple A but there games arent worthy of that
avatar
GameRager: 1st bit: I don't think the OP is one to stir the pot for a laugh/etc...just my two cents.
Ultimately without reading their mind, I have no idea. It did however seem like a somewhat silly thing to ask, and often such type of thing is just someone stirring the pot, so it made me suspicious. But clearly like many others, I responded anyway ... perhaps more fool us.

avatar
GameRager: 2nd bit: Eh, I would suspect the ones who balk at sales "not being good enough" even when the prices are more than 60% off or find any excuse to not buy games they have wishlisted as more of a threat to gog's existence then a few pirates who wouldn't have paid for the games anyways.
I'm not sure I understand what you are saying, as surely any price is subjective, almost arbitrary. One only has to have a quick look at the prices at GOG to see how wildly they vary. For some games, 60% off is indeed a great bargain, while for others it isn't ... depends on the game and the original price. Going by some reviews, even 100% off is not enough for some games.

There are often many factors involved when buying a game, and not just the price.
But some seemingly don't even care about price, and just buy because they want the game. Most sensible and discriminating people however, are cautious with their money.
They want to make sure they get good value for money, or minimize the risk for the outlay.

I myself, purchase many games on a whim, based on risk factors. The cheaper the game, the more risk I am willing to take, so long as the game captures my interest enough. So while I prefer to buy games cheap, you could say quantity is also an important aspect, when it comes to supporting GOG, as I have bought an awful lot in the last 30 months.

Of course, a lot depends on how well I know a game or seem to be able to tell. I will pay more if I know I like a game or feel pretty confident I will.

avatar
GameRager: Of course, saying that I think many many more should buy games on Gog to help it grow.
Indeed, and I second the motion, while leading as one good example to others,
Post edited October 12, 2019 by Timboli
avatar
aRealCyborg: I asked a game developer why his game is not coming to GoG and he is afraid that if he puts it on GoG he would lose a lot of revenue. He feels that GoG is a big reason in the pirating arena because of the DRM-Free versions of the game and does not feel like it is worth having his game on any other platform then itch or Steam.

So what I am saying is GoG a big cause of pirating?
And how much of a lose would a developer have if any if he puts it on GoG?

I feel that there is no lose to putting the game on GoG and I feel like if GoG was not around then people would find other ways to pirate, I bet there are already ways to pirate DRM version of games if you work hard enough.
No. Thats stupid.
avatar
ReynardFox: It's all lies I tell you!
B-b-but it's one of my favourite "childhood" books!
*confused in tank*
avatar
GameRager: I was more talking about would it be possible to "pirate" free software by downloading/using a version not meant for you/your "class"(i.e. business or personal).....as in would that be considered pirating? :|
avatar
rtcvb32: I can't think of where this 'class' would come into being.

I know Microsoft has put differences between 'business' and 'personal' by implementing limits. (Example, Windows XP could only accept 64 simultaneous connections max unless it was a 'server' edition. It was found to be binarily identical to the personal Windows XP, but with a few registry tweaks which Microsoft would sell you $800 more).

With free software, you specify the limits (in the configuration), and there isn't really a difference from the software perspective.. (Also any limitations you put in as a 'personal' version could be stripped and recompiled to remove it, making it pointless).

Is there a 'business' version of AWK vs a 'personal' version of AWK? I don't see why there would be. Or GIT, or XWindows?
I was trying to wonder/ask if one downloaded a freeware version of a piece of software meant for the other class(personal or business) if that would be considered piracy or not by said soft. makers/people/etc.....which itself was a musing after reading someone ask if freeware was possible to be pirated or not.
=================================

avatar
Timboli: I'm not sure I understand what you are saying, as surely any price is subjective, almost arbitrary. One only has to have a quick look at the prices at GOG to see how wildly they vary. For some games, 60% off is indeed a great bargain, while for others it isn't ... depends on the game and the original price. Going by some reviews, even 100% off is not enough for some games.

There are often many factors involved when buying a game, and not just the price.
But some seemingly don't even care about price, and just buy because they want the game. Most sensible and discriminating people however, are cautious with their money.
They want to make sure they get good value for money, or minimize the risk for the outlay.

I myself, purchase many games on a whim, based on risk factors. The cheaper the game, the more risk I am willing to take, so long as the game captures my interest enough. So while I prefer to buy games cheap, you could say quantity is also an important aspect, when it comes to supporting GOG, as I have bought an awful lot in the last 30 months.

Of course, a lot depends on how well I know a game or seem to be able to tell. I will pay more if I know I like a game or feel pretty confident I will.

avatar
GameRager: Of course, saying that I think many many more should buy games on Gog to help it grow.
avatar
Timboli: Indeed, and I second the motion, while leading as one good example to others,
1st bit above: I was more talking about people who want to buy a game/wishlisted it to buy and even when the game is 65% off and around 3-4 dollars(or their currency's equivalent) and is very reasonable/they want it more than other games they still complain the discount isn't good enough or find some other reason not to buy.

Some of them either dislike the direction gog is heading and want to act like a potential customer taking away a potential sale(with some of them), or they have other reasons(saving an extra 50 cents-1 dollar being very key to buying for some reason, even if they have the money and don't have many games, for example).

2nd bit above: One should always set a good example, this is true.
Post edited October 12, 2019 by GameRager
avatar
GameRager: I was trying to wonder/ask if one downloaded a freeware version of a piece of software meant for the other class(personal or business) if that would be considered piracy or not by said soft. makers/people/etc.....which itself was a musing after reading someone ask if freeware was possible to be pirated or not.
I suppose the only thing i can come up with, is downloads for specific countries. There was suppose to be governmental regulations where you couldn't export encryption software above 56bits encryption (has to do with how hard it is to crack and how long it would take. DES was a 64bit key cipher but lowered to 56bits and adopted as a standard as one reason). As such you could create a great security software but have to leave out or put a weaker cipher in to make it complaint. Though with the open sources, you could swap it out or have a patch and recompiled accepted in other countries.

No doubt there will be torrents of free software perhaps individually or as a collection, as if other sites go down that host those files, there will still be another backup way of it (Actually tons of torrents for iso's for distros). Though it isn't breaking any sort of copyright.